Eugene and Marina Borukhovich | The Power of Health Coaching

Andrea: [00:00:00] Welcome back to an episode of the HR scoop today. I have two guests. So double the fun today. I’m very excited to talk to Eugene and Marina co founders at Your Coach Health. So welcome Eugene and Marina. Thanks, Andrea. Great to be here. Pleasure. We don’t often have two guests, but you two, um, created this amazing company together.

And so, you know, why not? Why not have you both come and talk to us about coaching and how that interacts with employee health and the corporate world and, you know, all of that stuff. Therefore personal health. So we are very excited to hear more about it. So would one of you like to kind of bring us up to [00:01:00] speed on what your coach health is and why, why you’re here?

Marina: Yeah, I mean, um, I can take this one in a nutshell. Uh, we operate in scale health coaching services via our white label solution, or we can go direct to employer as well. And we do this via the largest cohort of validated coaches out there. And, um, the way we validate is we have a platform for health and wellbeing coaches.

They come in, they work with their own clients and then first algorithmically, and then through our, um, health coaching operations team, we pick the best of the best coaches and we work with them to deliver truly best in class health coaching services to our clients.

Andrea: That’s amazing. That’s amazing. I feel like over the last, I don’t know, maybe since 2020, um, the personal coaching in all the ways, right?

Executive coaching, career coaching, I’ve heard decision making coaching, [00:02:00] health coaching. I mean, coaching is having a moment and especially virtual when a lot of people weren’t able to access a therapist or even a workout class or anything in. Real life in the 3d. Um, we’ve kind of seems like there’s been a lot more opportunity and options to have things remotely.

And I think that’s amazing. And especially when it comes to people who don’t have those types of services available to them where they live.

Marina: Absolutely. I mean, it’s interesting how you brought 2020, right? I think we all know what happened then. Um, so we actually started working on your coach a little bit before then.

And then we officially incorporated in January of 2020 and we often get asked the question of how the pandemic has affected us and feel a little guilty saying that actually for the business, it’s been great. Because everything that we’ve been preaching up until that point, people finally realize the value in it.

It’s the value of preventative well being. It’s the value of delivering these [00:03:00] self, uh, services virtually. It’s the value of true, real behavior change and having somebody in your corner. So for us, it was kind of like, yeah, preaching to the choir. Yeah.

Andrea: So how did you get involved in this work? Because I mean, you started before we even knew it was the biggest deal ever that we were going to need kind of this interactive online support.

And what I found in my work over the years is that topics that really get a lot of traction start from somewhere personal. So does this have a personal slant for you? It has a very personal

Marina: slant. Yeah. Um, so I, I’m a very private person. So it took me a while to even talk about this publicly, but I am glad that I am talking about this now and I have a platform to talk about this.

But 10 years ago now, I was diagnosed with breast cancer. And, um, I was 37 at the time, so it was [00:04:00] devastating. You know, our kids were 10 and 12, but we’re living in a foreign country. So it was, it was a huge deal. And I was very, very lucky to be treated by the most amazing team of doctors who truly gave me my life back.

And while I was being treated, I felt that I was being very well taken care of and everything was under control. And I was really focused on getting better. The real challenge for me personally started after the doctors gave me the all clear and they said, Okay, you’re good to live your life now. This new life looked very, very different.

Then what my old life looked like. I had a new gift. I had a new lease on it and Anybody that I wanted to talk to all they wanted to talk about was my past So I was recommended a therapist and the therapist said let’s talk about cancer And I said that’s literally the only thing I don’t want to talk about He said, are you afraid about dying?

I said, that is literally what I don’t want to talk about. Don’t want to talk about death. Don’t want to talk about cancer. I want to talk about the future. It was like, okay, you know, like I’d rather talk about the past. [00:05:00] So that didn’t work. Maybe it was that therapist particularly, but to me, that was kind of an aha moment.

Because even like when I was trying to exercise or asking about like options for food They said whatever you feel good with whatever works for you. This is what you can do so that didn’t work and that’s when I discovered health coaching and That really really resonated with me and this new road back to well being back to health and I became a health coach myself Although I do not practice but dangerous enough to do so To know, um, to know good code to good and understand good coaching.

Um, yes, it became a health coach myself, realized the value in being able to deliver real health coaching because so much, I mean, health coaching has been given a bad rap by. so much out there, right? Because anybody can call themselves a health coach, right? Because it’s not so regulated and people are so vulnerable and they’re willing to share so much that if it falls into the wrong hands, a lot more harm can be done [00:06:00] than good.

So that’s why it became a mission to really understand good health coaching and to provide that real valuable health coaching to end consumers.

Andrea: Yes. Well, thank you for sharing.

Eugene: Yeah. And I think this is the longest I’ve been quiet with a mic in front of my face. So, uh, just, just want to a little bit, maybe chime in.

Um, obviously as a husband and watching the two girls going through a lot of this, you know, we’ve been, um, kind of around the holistic health and I’ve spent, you know, two decades in healthcare, health tech, um, including a number of years in big pharma where, you know, with the team that I. You know, that I was running, we were very much preaching the holistic care, you know, across, uh, kind of, uh, some of the earlier kind of digital therapies that are self paced.

So, you know, and, and a lot of the nonclinical workforce that is there to help, right? Which is so a lot of this kind of resonated, you know, we didn’t, you know, Set out to do the business together. It’s like, well, let’s do a [00:07:00] business together. That’s just kind of naturally happened. And I left big pharma and I joined Marina on this amazing journey that we’ve been on for four and a half years at this point.

Andrea: Wow. What timing and to have the skills and background and knowledge kind of step into it together is. It’s kind of power couple material. It feels like.

Marina: Well, we’ve been complimenting each other in life for 25 years. So it was time that we did something together, but we always make this point that we get asked a lot.

How is it to work together as husband and wife? And we didn’t. Say let’s have a business together and we didn’t set out to do this It just happens so organically and so naturally and we both bring a lot to it where we pick up where the other Lacks something right? I mean there’s days that I don’t want to do something He doesn’t want to do something and we just back each other up and I think the most important thing here is trust Um, and trust is the most important thing that you can have with any co founder.

And with us, you know, we’ve raised the family together. Like we’ve [00:08:00] been together for longer than we have not been together. Right. So it’s the thing that we have. And I think that really works well. For, for, for doing this together.

Andrea: Well, maybe I’ll have you come back and we can do a masterclass on working relationships and boundaries.

I don’t know if we’re there yet. So

well, I work in progress. It is amazing. And it will be a work in progress for ever. Um, so as you’ve taken and built this business and the world and the landscape has shifted as to what has been needed, how do you envision the future of Transcribed health coaching. What, what is that going to look like? Is there AI?

Are there coaching tools? Is it only human to human? Kind of give us what you’re thinking.

Eugene: Maybe I’ll, I’ll kick this one off. Um, and you know, given kind of the background and I think, you know, healthcare, health tech, um, Over the, let’s call it even 20 years [00:09:00] have over indexed on automation and technology.

Right. And I was one of the, I guess, earlier proponents of digital health and let’s call it self paced content, self paced digital therapies because access is important, right? Um, and I think, you know, especially, uh, you know, in, in us, uh, the conversation around access and giving people access along with the health equity is super important.

So I think. Tools, um, that are self paced, um, and you know, digital therapies are important. Now on the other spectrum, um, we have the clinical workforce that we know we have a shortage today and that shortage is not getting any better. All right. And so this is where we are seeing a lot of automation and AI tools to really just augment the clinicians.

And there’s this amazing. It’s non clinical workforce that are trained in science backed methodologies that can actually help these individuals that may fall off the self [00:10:00] paced tools, right? And also not adhere to a care plan. And part of that is a lot of the stressors that we’re all going through. So we do see health coaching as a key.

key component of the puzzle piece of the more holistic care and actually bridging the gap between, you know, the chatbots and the self paced tools and the clinicians that are just, you know, again, there’s just not enough of clinicians, you know, going forward and that shortage is not getting any better.

Andrea: Right. I think just as no one is going to win an argument by chatting on. Insert whatever social media tool you want. Real behavior change is not going to happen by being text something once a day to go drink more water. We all know that we all know we’re supposed to drink more water, but by having maybe some accountability and a person to talk to could, Could encourage it or make it feel more real.

Is that what you’re seeing? Like that [00:11:00] engagement of the person connection is what’s turning the dial.

Marina: I think it’s more about, you know, we need to define what real health coaching is, right? Like it’s not, you know, to answer what you were saying, it’s not a nudge. A bot can do a nudge, you know, and we all get them and we all swipe them away because they don’t really mean anything.

But what a real health coach does is they understand, right? So even let’s take your example with drinking more water. What does that mean to me? Does that mean drinking two cups a day? Does that mean drinking eight cups a day? Because everybody’s so individual and it, it differs for every person. Could somebody have a medical condition that doesn’t let them drink water as much as the next guy, right?

Like everybody’s so different. And that’s where real coach comes in. To understand what somebody’s goals are and what their limitations are and what their capabilities are, and to really listen and understand what they want. Because a lot of times we hear what we want to hear and. It’s really hard to get through the noise.[00:12:00]

Andrea: It really is. I know it’s a great point and it does come down to individualized information. And I know with, you know, WebMD Health Services, we have health coaches that we use with our clients and internally with our staff and the stories that come out of those one on one conversations and plans and changing lives and saving lives makes the work so worth it and really kind of.

Keeps directing the work to keep making those changes in people’s lives. So what was the motivator to expand your coach health for you all into corporate wellness?

Marina: You know, as any good entrepreneur and would like to think that we’re good entrepreneurs, or at least on the way of getting there, you know, we always listen to what the market wants.

So we have this white label solution that stands on its own. And it’s wonderful. And we’re able to plug health coaching services to any organization. And then we’ve heard from [00:13:00] corporates that they wanted to be able to access directly. And, um, We, our platform stands on its own. We can provide those services and what that gives us, it’s actually great because now there’s not somebody in between and we have an ear to the ground and we can listen and understand directly what it is that employers want, what it is that employees want and how we can better service them.

So actually going to corporate directly, going to employers directly is giving us an opportunity to better serve our white label customer base. As well, so it’s been kind of a win win all around,

Eugene: you know, an interesting part just to add to it. I mean, we’ve been serving employers again through our partners.

Right? Um, so I think some of the challenges, uh, I mean, an individual and as an individual, right? Um, it’s a human being that has the ebbs and flows throughout the day. You know, I think. Ultimately, what we’re hearing, and this is through our white [00:14:00] label customers, but also the direct, um, you know, again, I think Marina alluded to this, the word health coaching, you know, kind of, I mean, health coaching has been around for two decades plus, and to a certain extent, those two words got kind of a bad rep.

And ultimately, the buyers, the payers are not really buying health. Coaching per se. Right? And I think this is a little bit of the challenge for the industry. They bind some kind of an outcome, right? And again, it could be an employee that’s, uh, you know, within a sandwich generation, right? Caregiving, uh, you know, caring for their kids, but also caring for the parents or caregiver.

Um, you know, it could be a mother returning back to work, right? And so, uh, I’ll say broadly, kind of women’s health. Um, and all of these nonclinical, I’ll call them interventions just because I’m sure a lot of the listeners are in core health care. But, um, you know, that’s, that’s ultimately what people are buying, right?

Uh, and whether again, through our white label solution or direct, they’re buying for their particular individuals and buying some [00:15:00] solution. And, you know, our ability, Uh, you know, part of this is that we’re tracking coaches on our platform across 16 categories and metabolic health, heart health, women’s health.

And so we’re actually able to service almost any population regarding those, some of those challenges in a nonclinical way, just to be clear.

Andrea: Yeah, it makes sense, right? Nobody comes in. Well, I won’t say nobody, probably very few people come in and say, I want to work on my metabolic health.

They’re like, I want to be healthier. I want to run with my kids or I’m curious in a cash to 5k or women’s health, you know, there’s a million things that are very individual, which is why it takes an expert to understand.

Eugene: Sorry. And by the way, I mean, you mentioned, right, I don’t want to work on my metabolic health, but I could have comorbidities, right?

And I think that’s part of the challenge in the healthcare system where, um, you know, you look that as your body parts where, uh, health coach, again, while nonclinical can connect those [00:16:00] dots in your daily journey, your daily stressors around all, you know, comorbidities. And by the way, On top of that, again, you know, if I have to run to take my kids somewhere, that’s a stressor, right?

And why do I drop off and didn’t have that half a liter of water, right? Those are the things that coaches can actually help with on daily basis.

Marina: And a lot of times people come in and more often than not, they’re not coming in with clear goals. More often than not, they’re saying, I don’t feel well, I don’t know what’s wrong.

I’m just not. And it’s up to us. That’s up to our coaches to figure it out and to figure out how to help them. Because once they open up. It’s just, it flows. It just starts flowing and that’s when the true magic happens.

Andrea: Yeah. So speaking of that magic, do you have any examples that you could share, no personal information, of course, but any kind of success stories or, or highlights to give us a better idea of what that holistic approach might look like?

Eugene: We are HIPAA compliant [00:17:00] companies.

Marina: Oh my God. There’s so many, there’s so many, uh, one that comes to mind. It’s one of our recent. Um, recent stories. So this individual came in and they were transitioning. They were transitioning from male to female and they were ready to quit. They were ready to quit their job because they were, they were just starting hormone therapy.

They didn’t think that they would be understood. They didn’t think that, um, they could stay at their current position. So the coach worked with them for several months. And during that time, they worked on strategies on how to approach management. I mean, this was a pretty high level position that this person was in.

So they worked on strategies with coworkers, with family, family members, with management and to us and to them, it’s a success story because they ended up staying at their work, at their job, the, they’re thriving and their position, I mean, they’re still working with a coach. There’s different challenges of course, but this is a person who was ready to quit and who was ready because they were just.[00:18:00]

They didn’t think there was any other option, but now they’re there and they’re thriving and, you know, like anybody else just going through life’s ebbs and flows. And to us, it’s absolutely fantastic to share a story like this because a lot of time when you speak to decision makers and companies, they say, well, you know, I’ve, every, everybody’s fine.

You know, I want, I want to, I want to improve my productivity. Doesn’t this improve productivity when you have a happy employee who was ready to quit, but is now there and is now working alongside their team? But how do you measure that? When we talk about happier and healthier employees, this is what we’re talking about.

But how do you measure that? You know, so, you know, we talk about, everybody talks about productivity, like, let’s just call bullshit, you know, like, how do you measure productivity?

Andrea: Right. Well, and everyone listening, you can’t see me, but I’m doing a slow clap because these are real stories. And as you know, if you’ve ever [00:19:00] worked with people, which we all have, if you’re listening to this show, um, you don’t know what somebody is going through.

You have absolutely no idea what will make them more efficient or productive or engaged in almost. Always it is supporting them wherever they are to get through whatever is going on so they can then turn their focus and more of their attention to the job which they want to do anyway.

Marina: Absolutely. Like nobody wants to leave.

Nobody wants to quit, you know, and we, one of the things that we deal about with all the time, you know, we talked about the pandemic before the pandemic that nobody talks about is the loneliness. Like it’s not an epidemic anymore. It’s like, yeah, people are so lonely and loneliness does not look what you think it looks like.

I mean, I’m sure you know, this like people, they look like they’re thriving. They’re surrounded by people all the time, but they’ll connect with a coach and they’ll say, I am so lonely. I have nowhere to turn. Can I just talk to you? And these are employees, these are people that are by our [00:20:00] sides all the time, and this doesn’t need to be somebody who is, you know, a little bit older.

These are people of, these are young people, these are people who are just entering the workforce where the question they ask most is, am I liked by others, you know, like it’s, it’s hard. absolutely wild that we all think we’re so different, but everybody’s truly struggling with kind of like the same issues, right?

They just show themselves in different ways. So,

Eugene: yeah, I, but I, I do want to, the, the one that kind of stands out, actually, it’s sort of interesting, right? I mean, obviously we do quality modern, Monitoring and management, right. And especially for the folks that opt in and, you know, the one that strikes me, and this is around loneliness is a person that jumps on and, you know, sees their coach and just super startled to see a human being and says, Oh my God, there’s an actual human that I can talk to, um, and not an AI, you know, coach or AI avatar.

And, um, you know, and another example, it’s [00:21:00] a, you know, a husband whose wife just left with the kids and he hasn’t. seen her in three days with the kids, right. And just wanted to talk through things and sort of, I mean, there’s, there’s just, it’s, you can’t make this stuff up and just, it’s just people need help.

Simply need help.

Andrea: And people are lonely. And to your point, just because you have an email exchange or even a team meeting with someone at work, it’s not really scratching that itch of genuine human connection, which a coach is not. Your best friend. So not, let’s not get it twisted, but it is a real person that is spending their time, having a genuine conversation to engage in that.

That can be really meaningful, especially for people who don’t have a network or a community.

Marina: You know, a lot of times it matters more than having a friend because with friends, we’re always afraid of being judged. What are we going to say? Are they going to throw it back to us? Right back at us at some point.

Like if I have a fight with my husband, I’m not. And I’m, you know, this is hypothetical, not me having a fight with my husband, [00:22:00] of course, but I may not necessarily want to talk to my friend about it because when we’re fine, the friend’s going to be like, so yeah, is this still, you know, a jerk, right? Because we don’t want to do that.

We don’t want to paint somebody in a bad light. But if I talk to a coach, I’m This coach is nonjudgmental. Like there’s no judgment there. It’s just somebody that’s helping me get through a situation.

Eugene: And I’m going to remind all the listeners here that, and I think, Andrea, you kind of just mentioned it too.

This is not just a person to talk to. This is an amazing workforce that is really well trained and science backed methodologies to get people back on track. Right. So while they’re there to listen and actually, you know, we have this thing that, you know, if Eugene is coaching, we got to write alert because, you know, coaches are great in listening.

Right. Um, and great in kind of dissecting and bringing and reflecting with that individual to get them back on track. So, you know, again, for the audience here, just wanna make sure that it’s not just a listening ear. There’s science behind this amazing workforce.

Andrea: Right. And the listening is part of [00:23:00] it, but it’s not the whole Yes.

The whole thing. It’s brutal. Yeah. It’s one of them. Yeah. Uh,

Eugene: you know, as a matter of fact, and, and you know, I think as, as many people are in healthcare, health tech, and we’ve been in some of the panels with. with doctors that don’t necessarily understand the role of health coaching in there, right? Um, we actually last year put together something like 20 plus deep dives where we assessed, um, you know, all the clinical trials and studies out there, which are hundreds and hundreds and hundreds that have been actually been increasing over the last, you know, half a decade or so.

Um, and this is around, literally every single, you know, we have, uh, health coaching and caregiving, right? And the actual science behind the impacts, you know, metabolic health, we have mental health. Um, and so, uh, it is, uh, I’m going to keep stressing just, uh, a truly amazing set of individuals that really, You know, want to get up every morning and help other people.

Andrea: And we all need that extra help. [00:24:00] So I know you all, I’ve heard you talk about kind of this shift towards well care and some of your material. Can you explain to us what, what that means and kind of where that’s going?

Eugene: Yeah, I guess, you know, coming from health care, right? And again, I know there’s always this argument, you know, do you, do you, do you put the two words together?

Is it one word or do you separate and it’s an ongoing, you know, whether it’s dictionary and, and, and To us, health and care are almost, yes, they’re interconnected, but you know, the focus has been really on the care side. And I would argue actually the well care piece does not differentiate it. But the way we look at this is being well, So well being at the core of it and being healthy.

Um, and, you know, I know that our system, broadly speaking, very hard to justify things that are preventative in nature, right? [00:25:00] Very hard outside of the diagnostic. And the way we look at it is, you know, I mean, the idea of talking to, for example, uh, therapist before you have any challenges, it’s similar with coaching, right?

Um, you want to get on track before you even think about, uh, getting off track, right? It’s getting your goals, uh, set up. It’s, it’s working through it. So well care, you know, if I really had to kind of, um, just put some keywords around, it is preventive in nature. It is very much focused on health, not healthcare.

It’s focused on well, Being not well care as a whole. And again, I know the term well care is out there and then, you know, sort of the ongoing, I’ll call it maintenance for lack of a better term, uh, because, you know, we all ebb and flow, right. Um, and then finally, I think the last piece that I’ll use is just really need to be proactive about, you know, how we feel.

Marina: I’ll just add one more thing and it’s individualized because well care means different things to [00:26:00] different people. Of

Andrea: course, humans. Okay. So I guess rapid fire style. I’m curious, what do you all do to take care of yourselves? I mean, you’ve got this great platform. You’ve overcome many challenges. You run a business, you have a family, kind of what are you doing to help yourself stay well?

Marina: Um, so we try to set boundaries. Um, so on weekends we can’t talk about the business, but only in, um, Not operationally, but more about like where we wanted to go if we have great ideas, right? So it’s hard, it’s hard not to talk about it, but so that’s kind of our boundary for weekend. Though Monday

Eugene: morning, we both wake up to the scheduled Slack messages because as we think about operational things, we schedule them so they don’t pop up right away.

And so we maintain our mental health. 9

Marina: o’clock Monday morning, Slack just [00:27:00] goes off. Uh, but then, um, So to me personally, you know, like the physical aspect, you know, I love different forms of exercise. And for me, it’s more mental and the physical aspect of it is just the bonus. So for both of us, and I kind of wrote Fusion into it because he has promo when I’m doing something and it feels like he’s not.

We don’t spend enough

Eugene: time together. So I have to be 24 So for

Marina: example, uh, it was last year. A year before that, I woke up one day, it was like middle of January. And I said, you know what? I hate running, but I’m going to run every day this year. Like literally every day. And instead of being a sane person and saying, no, that’s crazy.

He goes, cool. I’ll do it with you. So both of us ran every day, no matter where we were, if we traveled, if it didn’t matter, rain, shine,

Eugene: doesn’t matter what it was.

Marina: 365 days, you know, like we put that in. So something like that. And then like every morning, you know, we get up at 630 in the morning and [00:28:00] until about 930, it’s our individualist time.

So we exercise, like we do whatever feeds our soul, right? Like we, he does his planting, you know, I’ll do some reading, we’ll cook breakfast separately, you know, and that’s kind of just, um, gets us going and sets us up for the day.

Andrea: That’s great. I think those are really good tips. A lot of people could use or incorporate, especially if they are working a hybrid or remote or other people are in the house, even really setting some time that even though we’re here together, we can be together, but not together together.

All the time.

Marina: Like our latest obsession, you know, like there’s a Barry’s just opened up literally like a four minute walk from us, you know, so like the latest obsession was, it’s Barry’s and we do that every morning. And some mornings like we’ll be on the way there and he’s like, and by the way, this class is at seven o’clock in the morning, right?

So he’s like, did you see that email? Like, no, you don’t talk to me about that email until we’re back from class. We’ve had a good workout and I’ve had my [00:29:00] coffee. That’s when we talk about that email.

Eugene: And actually I. Just decided one of the new habits that I’m going to implement is not until after the exercise, I will even pick up my phone just to give me that, you know, hour and a half without, right?

So we’re constantly learning, right. And, and, and adding kind of new habits on, on, on top of the existing ones to, to get ourselves back to best performance possible.

Marina: And we try to do the same for our team. Like, we recently implemented Mental Health Fridays, where for like one Friday a month, everybody is off.

They can’t be on, unless there is a fire. If there is a fire, everybody is back on, of course. But, you know, everybody is off, and everybody has to do something. And sometimes they’ll send us Slack messages or emails. I’m like, No, this is truly your time because they’re excited and you know, it’s a team that truly believes in what we’re doing and what we’re building.

Right? But this is just your time. So we’ve tried this just for the summer, but I think this is definitely something that we’re going to carry on throughout the year. [00:30:00]

Andrea: It’s great. And a solid reminder that you do have to keep trying new things. And what worked for you last year, it may have been amazing and perfect at that time.

And it may not be the best for where you are right now. And that’s okay. We are humans. And we need to keep mixing it up. Okay. That makes it hard on ourselves. That is hard in itself. So this has been a really great conversation, but before I let you go, I do want to ask you the final question. I ask all of our guests here to tell us something about yourselves that most people may not know an extra triple bonus points.

If it’s something the other one of you doesn’t know about the other one, since you’ve been together so long.

Eugene: So I’ll, I’ll, I’ll start maybe with the first one. I think, you know, that one, but, um, when I was. A kid, I want to say like four years old [00:31:00] ish, five years old. Um, apparently I took a big rock and I decided to throw it up in the air to see if it actually lands on my head. And it did. And you know, what I’ve been told is that I was kind of whisked away into hospital, but you know, on the other side of it was that it’s just my unstoppable curiosity.

So, and, and, and willingness to learn. So that’s how I sell it. Basically.

Andrea: I love that reframe.

Eugene: You did know that one, I think. I did

Marina: know that one and I had a comment, but I’m just going to hold it to myself. Post recording. Yeah. So I definitely not going to get super bonus points for this because he knows my obsession, but I love to read cookbooks.

Like, As like, I love to cook, but my cooking is usually like to experiment with things, but I love to get cookbooks and actually read them just for [00:32:00] stories, just to see where it originated from, like, it’s just my passion. And with those cookbooks, I also have an obsession with spices. So I am kind of not allowed to buy any more spices because.

Yeah,

Eugene: after a quarter of a century together, it’s very hard to find things that we don’t know about each other.

Andrea: True. But I didn’t know either of those things. So you still, you still have some bonus points. Yep. Yes. I am with you on the cookbooks. Not so much on throwing the rock up in the air and laying on your head.

Sorry, Eugene. But I feel like the whole of the cookbook, there’s Something very satisfying about having it laid out on the counter versus keeping your computer from going to sleep while you do the steps and then come back and you scroll down back through the, you know, history and life of this person who wrote.

Eugene: Well, I enjoy, super enjoy being the sous chef, uh, as one of those recipes get picked. Can I, can I

Marina: explain what, what the job of a sous chef [00:33:00] is in Eugene’s opinion, sitting there and taking stuff as I’m cutting, as I’m putting them in, just taking all the ingredients and sampling them beforehand. So not a true sous chef, but in his opinion, that’s what it

Andrea: is.

Okay. Official sampler. I like it. I like it. Well, thank you all so much for coming and telling us about health coaching and why Why it is so impactful to the lives of people. Thank you for the work you’re doing and we’ll see everybody next time. Thank you so much for having us. It’s been wonderful.